Interview with Coert Visser

We have the pleasure to publish an interview with Coert Visser, Dutch Psychologist, author and expert on the Solution-Focused approach. His blog has become over the years a trusted source of reference regarding cutting-edge Psychological research which is relevant to Solution-Focused practitioners, coaches and consultants.

So I was very excited to have the opportunity to pick his brain regarding matters we both care a lot about. Here is the interview:

Q: Can you briefly tell us how you got interested in the solution-focused approach?

A: Before I heard about the solution-focused approach I was working as an associate director at a very large international consultancy firm. I felt a certain dissatisfaction with my work which I did not fully understand. Somehow, I decided to reflect carefully and came up with the question: when did I really feel gratified with my work? When thought about this deeply I discovered to my great surprise that the four or five situations of gratification which I had identified were rather strange cases. They were situations in which I had worked with clients and in which I had worked quite differently from what was normal for the firm and for myself. Yet, the clients had been very satisfied.

All of these cases had a few things in common. First, I had asked many questions; in particular variations on the questions: “What do you want to achieve?” and “Why do you want to achieve that?” Second, instead of providing standardized prescriptions for solutions I thought along with clients and really tried to understand them. And I improvised. I was very confused when I found this out. A few days later I was talking about this with a colleague manager and shared my discovery: “I have found I am most successful in my work for clients when I am asking questions.” He replied: “I understand. But I don’t think clients will pay money for questions. We’re in the business of providing answers.”

That was when I realized it might be better to leave the company and start my own business. When I realized this, however, I had no idea at all how I would do it. Then, one of the people who worked in my team, and whom I still work with intensively, Gwenda Schlundt Bodien, told me she wanted to follow a training program in solution-focused training. She briefly explained what it was about and I remember being skeptical thinking to myself it sounded very simple and not very new. A few months later I was walking in a book store and I saw this book: Interviewing for solutions. I picked it up and realized it was about the approach Gwenda had told me about. The book looked rather nice and I bought it. I sat down somewhere with a cup of coffee and started reading. Perhaps an hour later the potential of the solution-focused approach hit me with great force. I suddenly saw the connection with the success cases I had identified when I was reflecting on my work. I felt inspired. I felt this approach would be very important for me in the years to come.

Q: How would you say working solution-focused has made you a better coach and consultant?

A: There are many aspects to this. How can I explain? The main thing, I guess, is the approach has helped me to help clients quicker and more effectively. Also, conversations with clients have become more pleasant, both for them and for me. I approach situations much more openly which helps me to connect much better to what clients are actually saying and asking. They feel taken seriously. In addition to this, through the questions I ask and the conversation that emerges, they become more aware of what they want and feel that they find ways of getting there themselves. Because they discover that they are already doing some things that work, they become more hopeful and confident. And because they identify, or define, steps forward themselves, they are much more likely to start moving in a positive direction. Their awareness of their freedom of choice and of their competence is also supported. All these things make it much more likely that any positive change they are able to achieve is sustainable. In general, there is very little chance of them becoming dependent on me as a coach.

Q: With your blog, now 4 year-old, videos and social media presence you have become a trusted reference for solution-focused practitioners all over the world. Can you tell us more about that? How did it get it started, how do you keep going, and what are your plans for the future in this respect?

A: Lots of friends were talking about blogging and saying to me I should start doing it. I did not understand what it was and decided to start doing it to find out what it was. At first it was hard. I described some of the basics of the approach and wondered what on Earth I could be writing about further. But after months I started noticing that blogging was slowly becoming something of a habit. Also, it had some benefits. Having to explain something forces you to consider it deeply. The person explaining often learns at least as much as the person reading or listening. Then, gradually, I started to get very nice responses from people from around the world. Professors mentioning they showed my videos in their classrooms, coaches writing me to thank me for certain posts, interview or articles, students asking me for tips, etc.

I really enjoy the way I feel more connected to the world at large by blogging and the feeling of contributing something which may be useful for people I may not even know. Gradually, the topics about which I write have become broader. I have decided to write about anything that fascinates me whether there is a direct connection to the solution-focused approach or not. But usually there is a connection and I will try to explain the connection. Blogging has also helped me to learn a lot and to become a better writer. That is a great thing and a good reason to keep doing it. I happen to like writing.

Q: I am always impressed by how you keep current with the latest research in psychology, be it social psychology, neuroscience, or cognitive science. What would you say are the 5 most relevant insights gained in psychology in the last few years that support, in a way, solution-focused practice?

A: First off, let me say that  I am interested in research which is somehow related to the solution-focused approach; the research does not have to support it, it may also disconfirm aspects of the approach. I am neutral with respect to that because I am not necessarily interested in preserving the solution-focused approach as it was once described. It will have to change anyway. Anything that will remain the same will lose its vitality. By the way, most interesting approaches I have come across both provide support for some aspects and make refinement possible for other aspects.

For instance, Carol Dweck’s research into self-theories, which I have written about a lot, can be seen as doing both. Very briefly summarized her work shows that the belief that beneficial change is under your control is often a prerequisite to achieving it. This supports the solution-focused approach’s attention for subtly supporting the clients expectations of the possibility of improvement. At the same time, Dweck has found out certain things about giving compliments which refine SF’s view on complimenting, namely process compliments work very well and that person-focused compliments have specific disadvantages and are better avoided.

Another example of research which is very interesting from a solution-focused perspective is the work into self-determination theory. Lots of different studies have shown the effectiveness of lots of ‘solution-focused’ practices like giving positive feedback, taking the perspective of the other person seriously, providing choice, and so forth. Self-determination theory and the solution-focused approach, in my view, fit together very well as I have described in a recent paper. Both approaches have the potential of enriching the other.

In addition to this, there are lots of studies which are relevant. Examples are studies into positive emotions, the reactance effect, priming, brief attributional interventions, the motor-perception link, the role of memory in goal setting, and the motivational effects of visualizing. The list goes on. It’s interesting.

Q: What are your thoughts about scientific research vis-a-vis Solution-Focus?

A: The story goes that the solution-focused approach was developed in an inductive rather than theory-inspired way. The people who originally developed most of its principles and practices largely followed a bottom up approach to find out what worked. The inductive character of the development of the approach and its social constructionist inspiration may explain a certain reluctance within SF circles to embrace theoretical frameworks. This reluctance has probably been very useful at the time of its development of SF and has stimulated the discovery of a wonderful set of principles and techniques. But as the approach has matured and has spread its wings across a wide range of settings, I think the time is right to start doing more research and to explore connections with existing bodies of knowledge and to not shy away from theories. This may stimulate further refinement of how we work.

In fact, I believe, the solution-focused approach cannot permit to keep from from following scientific developments and making scientific contributions. . Clients, organizations and society will simply demand that solution-focused professionals justify what they do by scientifically testing their claims. This means we need to do systematic research and to explore and establish links with research into other approaches and disciplines. This way knowledge can be integrated across disciplines and further developed. By the way, I think this view is now beginning to be more broadly accepted among solution-focused practitioners.

Q: What do you think are the key ingredients of a solution-focused conversation?

A: There are several ways of trying to answer this question. For instance, you may follow a descriptive approach and explain how a more or less prototypical solution-focused conversation might go. For instance, you could say that solution-focused conversations often start by clarifying the need or desire for change of the client. Then, the desired situation may be described in very specific behavioral terms. Next, the coach and the client may look at what is already there and what has already been working. After that, a past success may be searched and explored. Next, a step forward may be chosen by the client.

Of course, the usefulness of such an approach to describing the solution-focused approach only goes so far and it should not be taken to strictly. In many solution-focused conversations not all of these steps will be there and the order in which these ingredients may be used may vary from time to time and from client to client. Also, the idea of the solution-focused approach as simply going through a series of steps is, of course, too simple. Often, the process will unfold iteratively. For instance, after having explored the desired situation you may go back to further clarifying the desire for change.

Another way of answering your question about the key ingredients is one which I recently came up with. I propose solution-focused coaching essentially consists of four activities. The first is to support client choice. Solution-focused coaches not only respect and work with clients’ autonomy and right to choose but they also deliberately ask questions and create opportunity that enhance clients’ sense of autonomy and choice as much as external goals and circumstances allow. The second is to utilize the perspective of the client. The perspective of clients is asked about and worked with. What clients bring forward is seen as and treated as useful.  The third is to inquire about success both in the future, present and past. Questions are asked aimed at getting vivid descriptions of desired success in the past, present and future. The fourth is to express positive expectations. Throughout the process of helping clients solution-focused practitioners express subtly their expectations that clients will be able to cope and take steps forward and eventually to achieve what they desire to achieve.

Q: One of the recurring themes of your posts seem to be the power we all have to change for the better, and you often brilliantly dispute anybody that uses science to put limits on that – be it genetic determinism, intelligence testing, or stereotypes. Can you tell us more about this passion of yours?

A: As an adolescent I had gradually developed an optimistic view on what we can learn and accomplish. This view was based both on some personal experiences and on some popular psychology books I had read. This was one of my reasons for being interested in psychology. Later when I started to study psychology, this optimism was kind of shaped out of me, step by step. I learned about intelligence and personality and how there were substantial differences between people in these traits. These differences were thought to be rather strongly genetically determined and usually hard, sometimes impossible, to change. Later, in my work as a selection psychologist, this view was further reinforced.

After many years some cracks in my beliefs about the relative immutability of capabilities and traits began to emerge. I gradually became more skeptical about the claims of this view on people and about the research behind it. Among the books which confirmed my doubts were books by Robert Sternberg, Stephen J. Gould and David Perkins. When the solution-focused approach came into my life, I started to find my original optimistic view on people and change back. The longer I had applied it, the more I began to become a believer in the possibility of growth and change. That is one of the interesting things about solution-focused practice: it both requires optimism and enhances it.

This process was strongly supported by developments in scientific psychology, specifically the work by Carol Dweck and her colleagues. In recent years there is an huge body of knowledge growing which asks for a view on intelligence, personality and all kinds of personal characteristics which allows the possibility of much change and improvement. Countless books have been written which document recent findings in different disciplines of science with are evidence against genetic determinism and which actually show that anything that anyone does is actually an improvable skill.

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You can also follow Coert Visser on Twitter: @DoingWhatWorks

Tags: Coert Visser, Growth Mindset, Interview, Psychology, research, Self-determination theory, Solution Focus, What works